Chenelle Hancock: Visually impaired learning

This is the Actual Fluency Podcast, helping you become a better language learner by providing motivating weekly inspiration, as well as top tips and tricks from expert guests. And now, your host, Kris Broholm.

I'm I'm visually impaired so I have um I would be called partial. So on my right side I can't see anything on the right side of my body, never could. Um, I have what's called retinopathy of prematurity, which is an eye disease that um I was born three months premature. I was born in the sixth month. So going into the third trimester, to be honest. And I was born 1 pound 13 ounces. So they did not know if I was going to live or die. And my mother was going 16, going on 17 years old when she gave birth to me. So she only had one kidney. I was lucky to be here and um I had to be in an incubator for like 5 months until I gained 5 pounds. And I was this little itty bitty pea pod that you could fit in the palm of your hand, I kid you not.

Is it tough to learn, because I I don't know anything about it except uh the concept, uh is it something that's uh hard to learn Braille or?

Mm-mm, no. Um actually if you're sighted, you can learn if you if you're sighted, you can learn it, um using your vision. But I wouldn't recommend it, because it's like, okay, well, it's it's a reading and writing system, and I've actually had to correct a few people on on the Polyglots page because they assume that it's a language. And I was like, no, it's it's not a language. It's it's a system of reading and writing. So, um,

They just want more languages on their badge, you know.

Oh, yes, yes, I know. And it's like, okay, well, um nowadays, you know, if Braille is very hard to come by, um it's very expensive to produce. So for every print page, which is 80 columns, you cut that in half, that's two Braille pages. So if you have a 350-page book, you you cut that in half, that's about 700 pages. And that's about four or five volumes of Braille right there. Like I actually read The Hobbit in Braille.

Oh, wow.

And it was 459 pages in Braille, but in print, it was only 272, so.

Oh my God.

You know, it's it yeah, but mostly

That's pretty crazy.

Mostly, Braille reading's okay. I mean, it's not like I'm I'm not like a lot of people I know where they could read like 90 to 100 words a minute. Um, but I I get by.

That's super cool.

Um I most yeah. But it's not it it really isn't that difficult. Um I think it depends on the person. It usually takes a person a year to to learn it. Um however, you might want to know this one. Braille is in uh just about every language in the world, so they even have Danish Braille.

Wow, I did not know that.

I just wanted to let you know that. Yes.

That's super interesting.

Yes. And um so they have what's called Unified English Braille, and we just adopted that as of last year on January 1, where all of the information is going to be in Unified English Braille because the seven countries of the world that are English-speaking, the UK, um New Zealand, Australia, South Africa, Canada, the United States, and Nigeria, um they all had their own Braille codes. And so sometimes when you're sending somebody something in print and they want to translate it over into a BRL um Braille format, um then it's very difficult because of the different symbols and and punctuation and what. So they wanted to make it a lot more easier for people.

Well, that's really interesting to hear that that's being innovated that much, that that's just last year that that happened. I I thought this was kind of like a system that was developed ages ago and it was kind of like, you know, set to just be whatever it is and then But it's really cool that they're working on it.

Oh, no, no, there's so many different, like because everybody's like, okay, it was developed in France by Louis Braille. However, it's been modified and updated and rechanged like so many times over, it's unreal. So like right now, um because I'm I'm still learning Russian after 25 months. Um, I'm I learned I taught myself Russian Braille. And all Russian Braille is is the alphabet.

Right.

So and some punctuation because they spell everything out, it's phonetic. So they spell everything out and I um I thought, well, my next two languages are French and Egyptian Arabic and they have those codes. So it wouldn't be difficult for me to learn the alphabets, so I would be able to read and write in those languages.

Right.

Um however, I don't use print that much unless I'm signing my name on the dotted line, or I have to write a check with my big print checks or something like that, but aside from that, I don't write essays anymore longhand.

How's that?

I haven't written longhand in about give or take about 17 years.

Oh, we don't use it much anyway, so you know,

Well, you know, and it's sad because someone was telling me, we were having this conversation, me and a friend of mine, and she said it's a shame that this generation doesn't even know how to write.

Yeah, it really is. Like my handwriting is, you know, you can have terrible handwriting but consistent, like doctor handwriting, you know? And then there's just terrible, you know, like mine is just terrible. It's just all over the place. It changes every single I could write the same word 10 different times on the same page or 10 different ways. Um so it really is a shame and and actually, I did the IB, I don't know if you know what the IB is, it's like a standardized high school exam that's all over the world. And because it had to be the same all over the world, you couldn't be sure that every student had access to a computer. So we had to actually do all the exams in hand after 12 years of schooling with absolutely no handwriting.

Oh my God. Well, you know, and it's so funny because I remember I grew up in the time where, you know, I didn't have a computer. I didn't own one until 2001 when I started college. And um yeah, I did everything longhand, or I had used a typewriter, like that was the first thing I learned how to use. When I was like 9 years old was a manual typewriter. Put the paper in.

Right.

Yeah. So, but it it to be honest, it's sad because if they don't know how to do simple math, if they don't know how to read and write, technology can fail just as quickly as it came into existence. And if we're all wiped out from technology, period, and they don't know how to do simple things,

Yeah.

Yeah, we're screwed.

Well, they say you remember better as well if you they did a study with uh university notes. If people did it on the computer, they remembered far less than if they did the notes by hand. So there's some brain-hand connection as well that's being completely uh ignored or made obsolete or something, so.

Oh, yeah, cuz I know in the blind community, the blindness community, they will teach these kids how to use Jaws and and ZoomText and Magic. Magic and ZoomText, they're two magnifying software programs for people that are low vision. And, but they will teach them all this stuff but they won't teach them Braille.

Hm.

Because, "Oh, well, you live in a sighted world," and in the sighted world you have to do print. Well, guess what, at the end of the day, there's an 80% unemployment rate for the blind in this country. Why? Because they're not equipped to be able to compete with their sighted peers because they don't have access to a refreshable Braille display to hook up to their computer so they can read what's on the screen.

That's true, yeah.

So, because of that, um and because, well, their parents can't afford a display that's a $1,000 up to like $10 grand. Um, because it's expensive. This stuff takes so long to make.

Yeah.

Just the cells by itself is unreal. And so, you know, you have to go through vocational rehabilitation services, commission here, and a lot of it now is, okay, employment. We need to get you gainful employment, you know, and is it about what the the consumer wants, you know, what type of job they want to be trained for, or is it just because you need to fulfill a quota?

Mm.

And, yeah, I mean, it's it's pretty sad. Like right now, I just got finished getting my certification to teach English as a foreign language and I did it all online.

Yeah, I saw that. That's really cool. Good job.

Yeah. Thank you. So I, you know, now I'm looking for, you know, tutoring jobs. I'm actually going to see if I can make a profile on iTalkie and there might be a couple other places I might look at to try to get my foot in the door, um so I can make a little bit of money. Cause my goal is to be able to teach in Russia. So, um, especially the disabled in Russia. Because I've I mean, I've heard of, you know, blind people in Russia that, you know, it's hard for them.

Yeah.

You know, they don't have some of the technology or some of the access to some of the things that we have here in the States. And um, and they don't have this sort of freedom either. You know, they're kind of like protected and sheltered.

Right.

Um somewhat. Depending on where you live. Now if you're in Petersburg, you're in Moscow, you might have a little bit more freedom. You can go to school, you can get a job, stuff like that, but I mean Putin has done more reforms to help the disabled a lot more. Actually, as of as of now, they actually have uh electronic um don't walk signs to indicate when it's time for you to walk across the street. We have those here in the States, but it's like your main street crossings, it's not like your side streets, which you know.

Yeah, we don't have that at all here in the States. I mean, uh luckily, we have the the sounds at most crossings, but otherwise, you would be mostly on your own, I guess.

Well, yeah, I I mean, a lot of people, you know, they either use a dog, or they use a cane, it's a personal preference. Not everyone is forced to get a guide dog. Um, I mean, you actually have to have good traveling skills.

Yeah.

To be able to get a dog in the first place. I mean, and it is a big responsibility. Bono was my first guide dog. And July 21st, it'll be three years since we've been paired. So I'm quite happy with him.

So there's owner training just as well as dog training.

Oh, no, no, no, actually what happens is that you um after a year of having your dog, because they wanna make sure that this is what you want and that you're comfortable. So after you're at whatever school you apply to, I applied to Guide Dog for the Blind in in California, and I went to their Oregon campus because it was their Portland was kind of similar to Cleveland. And so, um I was there for two weeks with him. And we graduated afterwards. And for that whole year, you're bonding with that dog. And so, um as a result of that, you find out if this is something that you really want to do. I mean, it's like having a kid.

Yeah.

The only difference is is that the school pays for his vet care, gives me free heartworm and flea and tick medication for a year. So the only thing I have to pay for is like his toys, his grooming, his dog food, which I get online for little or nothing. And um I pretty much groom him at home myself. I put him in the bathtub and give him a bath and and comb him out and brush him out and, oh, yeah.

Super.

He's spoiled.

So, thank you so much for that, uh, that little uh this is just an amazing story. I mean, I I I can't believe that like all that you've been through just from the start of your life. But um, let's move into sort of the language learning. When did you first begin the get the interest or the awareness that, "Oh, there are other languages than English in the world," and and when did you get an appetite for actually learning them also?

Um actually, when I was like 5 years old, um a friend of mine, we she's about 7 years older than me. And we would play together. However, she kind of knew that I had an aptitude to pick up things very quickly. And so she started teaching me American Sign Language, for which I became fluent at that time. And we started signing to each other. But I had moved from New Jersey at the time, because I had lived in Jersey for like the first 6 years of my life. And um we had moved back to Cleveland and I went to a school called A.G. Bell, uh Alexander Graham Bell, um for like the third second and third grade, if I can remember right. And then I went to like, um Anthony Lane, which is right next door for fourth and fifth. Not, um keep it up. I only remember so much, so I forgot a lot of it. And then I kind of learned a little bit of Spanish from Sesame Street. So watching Sesame Street and um it wasn't until I was at a school called Futures Academy in Buffalo, New York, um where I learned some Spanish. And I mean like very little. Like I was in there for a week. And the reason why was because I could not read the blackboard. I couldn't read the print in the book. I had to have a closed caption television to enlarge the print in order to read it. And you can't take that with you down the hallway.

Right.

You know, so, so, you know, um, I was mainstreamed, but it was very hard. Um, they thought after me learning Braille, maybe I need to go back to the print because there wasn't anybody around to to, um help me, pretty much. So like a teacher's assistant. So, I I went through I probably from the time I was 5 up until I was 14, I went to 10 different schools and, 1, 2, 3, 5 different states. Now, let me see that back. Yeah, five different states. No, six different states, I'm sorry. So, I went to two different schools in New Jersey, I went to one in New York, um Buffalo, New York. I went to Mendel Hall Middle School in North Carolina. Um, I went to a school in Tuscaloosa, Alabama for like 5 months, like my sixth grade year. And um I finished out my sixth grade year in North Carolina. No, no, no, not North when did I? Uh, let me remember. No, I finished it out in Jersey. And then I started my sixth grade year, I mean seventh grade year in Buffalo. Then in the middle of the year it was Cleveland. And then I finished it off in North Carolina. That's how much we moved around.

Wow.

So, and then the school system had gotten so bad that I was getting bullied every day to the point where my lunch money was getting stolen. Um people were taking pencils and putting them in pencil sharpeners and poking me in the back of the neck during English class. All because they didn't like me because I was very well dressed and, you know. And so, and I was visually impaired. So, I mean, I got basketballs thrown in my face, I got textbooks hit in the face, I yeah, it was bad. It got to the point where the last day of my seventh grade year, we had a pizza party on our bus and the kids decided to clean the bus. And so what they did was they took a water hose, turned it on and sprayed me and the bus driver and the whole bus with it.

Wow.

Yeah, so, yeah, my mother was like, that's enough. Oh, no. Absolutely, never again. Oh, no. So, I wound up going to the Ohio State School for the Blind in Columbus from January of 92 to June of 99. And um I actually stayed an extra three years, um, at the blind school for reasons I'd rather not go into, but I learned a hell of a lot while I was there. I was on the cheerleading squad, I was on the track team, I was editor of my yearbook, I was in two different choirs. Um, I was drama, I did drama. I was we competed all over the country with other blind schools and I also worked in food service for three years and did some work for like Ohio National Food Bank and American Diabetes Association and the YMCA for a year and a half. So I got a lot of work experience along with my education as well. And then I I ended up graduating with honors, um, two weeks after my mom passed.

I'm sorry to hear that.

So, um which was very difficult.

Thank you.

And uh, thank you. But while I was in high school, no languages. Um, whatsoever. It wasn't until I got to college, um, in 2000, when I took Spanish. And I didn't want to really take that. I didn't have a choice, mainly because that was the only language that they were teaching from beginning to end. Like they had French and they had Russian, which I would have gladly have taken because those were the two languages of choice I really wanted to take ever since I was 13. And I wasn't able to. And because I went to Cuyahoga Community College in Cleveland, and I went to the Eastern campus. And if you wanted to take French, you had to go downtown. If you wanted to take Russian, you had to go on the West side. And I'm like, I'm not traveling all the way over there just for that, okay.

Right.

And it's such a so frustrating. I mean, the most I was able to do was order my food at a Spanish restaurant and maybe cuss somebody out.

Right.

So, I mean, don't get me wrong. I I I love the culture, I love the dancing, I love the food, I love the music. I still listen to Shakira and Santana and Enrique Iglesias and Ricky Martin and Pitbull and Jennifer Lopez. I love all that. But don't ask me to speak it. I have a very bad confidence problem with speaking it. Mainly because I didn't have the support that I needed, and I did it the old-fashioned way. I had a book, a hard print textbook, a Mexican-American woman teaching me, an African-American guy teaching me, and my professors. And I would spend five hours a day learning Spanish. I was good at the grammar, I sucked at the vocabulary. And I could actually correct people on, you know, their verb tenses and, "Oh, no, that's the wrong ending. You said this, you were supposed to say that."

Right.

I can I can translate it on paper. You read it to me, I can tell you what it said. But I couldn't speak it worth it. And it was just it was bad. I mean, I I went as far as to move all the way to California. And, you know, that's like the second capital of, you know, Spanish-speaking country. And I thought, oh, right, I could speak it now. Nope.

No.

They wanted to speak English. And I was like, oh, my God. So, I mean, and it was I I got a lot of rude comments from people. You need to practice more. You suck. Stop messing up our language.

That's pretty evil.

I just I just stopped. Like literally, I was like, screw this language. This sucks. And and it took me, oh, I would say about 12 years to pick up another language. And then I said, you know what, to hell with this. I'm going to pick up the language I want to. And this is when technology started to get better. So, I decided to do Russian. And I said, I'm going to find me a podcast, something free, to get the basics down. And um this is after my college years. Um, I would say it was like March of 2015. Um, I started learning Russian by myself with uh Russian Made Easy by Mark Thompson, his 30-lesson podcast and then I, um went on to do Memrise and RussianPod101.com, which I'm friends with Stacy Johnson, one of the customer service people. And um I'm always plugging that.

Yeah, I love it too.

That website to people all the time.

Yeah.

Yeah, and and um but it it got to the point where I outgrew it. So, now I'm using um Memrise a lot. And um I actually finished year seven and year six of um Russian on on that app. And then I also have um RT the RT channel on my um cable subscription and I watch that religiously, like all the time. So, I'm listening to the news in Russian, I'm listening to President Putin in Russian like constantly. And I actually learned a lot of um vocabulary just from listening to like Radio Verojka. I don't know if you've heard of that podcast.

No.

It's out of it's out of Moscow. And it's free. And I I've done that. And then I did Toru, but for some reason, after a while, it stopped working. So, I don't know what happened. But um I do that. And then TuneIn Radio. I've done Assimil Russian. I completed the whole, well, the first half of it. Now I'm on the second half. Um, and yeah, I just I practice every day. I listen a lot. I do a lot of listening. My writing is not the best. Um Google Translate's become my new best friend.

Oh my God.

So, I so if you notice, I've written you in Russian, but what I've done is I I write it in English and then I have it translated in the Russian to make sure that what I'm saying, you know, comes out better. because my writing is really bad. It's appalling. And um but I'm getting better at, you know, speaking. Um, I've actually ran into a few people and I've just been able to speak spontaneously, um, to them without any nerves whatsoever. Maybe because I have a passion for it. I'm a big history buff because I studied theater at Kent State, um from 2003 to 2006. And so I studied acting and um producing. So therefore, I have always been very much a very a liberal arts type of person, not so much mathematical or science. Oh, I suck at that. Well.

Me too.

Yeah. So, um, what kind of challenges did you have when you started to learn Russian? You said that the technology had gotten better and and like I see you sometimes write posts on the Facebook group yours asking people for do you have an audio resource for this or this particular area? Is that is that the is that the main problem that that it's mostly in written form and and not in audio?

Yeah.

Right, right. And I I actually have found a couple of websites that are Russian that you can get audiobooks for like $5 here, one year, two years. But the pro you only can listen to them in that particular app.

Mm.

However, um what makes the situation even worse on my end is because everything is in print, um, they have a lot of resources for like if you have Spanish, if you're French, or German, Italian, um, Dutch, Swedish, Chinese, Japanese, oh, and Korean is really popular now.

Oh, wow.

So, so if you if you like Korean Pop or K-Pop or oh,

The food.

The food, yeah, you're going to be in heaven. Russian, uh, not so much. Arabic, yes, that's becoming popular. Um, Swahili, um, you know, Lao, all these other different languages, yes. Um, it's becoming, you know, that's more popular. Russian, it is very hard.

Right.

And and I'm lucky because evidently, I studied theater and film. And so, like I I have Leviathan, I have Alena, um, but the movie has to be like really popular in order for it to be distributed here in the US. If it's not popular, um, you better start looking on the internet somewhere. And because Amazon doesn't really have like a lot of they have Russian titles but not a lot, you know, because evidently Amazon doesn't really go to Russia.

Right.

Um and you can't like get stuff in Russian unless you switch your keyboard over digitally, type the title you want and see if they have it in iTunes. That you can buy. Like I just bought um Anna Karenina and um, War and Peace in Russian, the the the e-book form. And I can have VoiceOver read it to me, or I can hook up my Braille display and I can read it with my Braille display.

Oh.

So, so that that that's one good thing. But when it comes down to if I want to read Harry Potter in Russian,

Oh, yeah.

Or Game of Thrones in Russian, actually, I did get Game of Thrones. Someone actually, someone was kind enough to actually send me Game of Thrones in Russian, the first book, in Russian audio.

Wow.

Um, which was great. But it's very hard. I mean, you guys are lucky. You all can find stuff all over the place. And it wouldn't be that difficult, because you guys are in Europe.

For sure.

Here, oh, it's.

It's pricey, though. Like, uh, if you want to go on, uh, and get, let's say, a Russian Harry Potter, for instance, you pay $30 shipping or something, at least where I live. So, that's that's not fun.

What? Oh my God.

Yeah.

Um so it's Shipping and handling here is like maybe like $5.

Yeah, so there are ups and downs. Like it might be more available here, and it's not as far, but you know, those uh shipping rates are really often the killer for me. Um but of course, you can get you can find maybe a an e-book or something, but I I always find it it's harder to read on on the screen instead of the like if I have a proper physical copy. Yeah.

And your hand.

Um what about Netflix? You ever tried Netflix? Cause I I don't use it but I I heard from people who say that they have lots of languages and stuff.

They have lots of languages. The problem is is that Russian is not like the most popular on the face of the planet. I will tell you Spanish and Chinese and Japanese and Korean. They have a whole site, a whole page of nothing but Korean because people are going crazy for Korean. It's ridiculous. It's but I think that's kind of cool though.

It is, yeah.

I don't I don't I don't know if I would do Korean.

I don't know either.

I don't know if I I mean, the.

The barbecue's nice but.

Yeah. Like I've well, I am dipping into two more languages, possibly three.

Oh yeah.

Um French, French, and I'm also dipping into Egyptian Arabic. Um I I actually volunteer at this nonprofit organization called um Project Learn. And they teach people how to um, they teach them English for free. And you also can get your GED, you also can get to the point where you can apply for your citizenship. And I've been um volunteering since September, and we have a lot of different people who have come over from um, Afghanistan, Iraq, Yemen, um, Syria, um, Jordan, um, Guinea,

Sure.

Um, you name it. Uh, someone actually came over from Burma, but their Karen. And they lived in the jungle because they're their their their father was a Karen soldier. So a Karen soldier couldn't live in the city, they had to live out in the middle of the jungle. And she she talked about her life and everything in a presentation like last this past December and it was just phenomenal. You know.

So, yeah.

So I I I help with teaching English to people and I I get to practice a little French and a little bit of Egyptian Arabic, though little I know. And I do use um Michelle Thomas. I like it better than Pimsleur. Pimsleur is a little slow.

Oh, yeah.

And I mean, you'll be sitting there forever like, oh, my God, will you shut up already.

30 minutes, the longest 30 minutes of my life.

Uh yeah. Now, I understand like people like Ellen Jovin, which I used to be friends with on Facebook, but not anymore.

Me too.

Yeah, she she loves Pimsleur.

Right.

I fell in love with Assimil. And I fell in love with Michelle Thomas and I fell in love with Memrise. I hate Duolingo. Um, I don't I just I didn't like it. I thought it was boring.

Hmm.

And it was not challenging enough for me. Of course, you know, when you have a bachelor's degree and two certifications and you're on your third language, your second foreign language, but your third language overall, it's it's very um it's kind of difficult to be like, oh, well, I want to No, this is boring. Okay,

So weird sentences and stuff.

Yeah, yeah, and I'm like, you're not going to say this. Now, I mean, I've gotten the the questions that everyone get, "Why are you learning Russian?" I mean, it didn't matter who you were. And I said, because I like it. That was my response. I like it. I love the people, the food, the culture, the politics, the history, the country, and I don't even live there.

Right.

You know. So, I said, I want to go to Russia, um, really badly. Um, that is my dream, like along with backpacking all over Europe. Um, and seeing Denmark and seeing, um, Sweden and Germany and France and in and in London and, oh, yeah, I'm a big history buff and artistic person and I love the theater and film and which I studied in college. And so, yeah, I pretty much, my whole language journey is I want to communicate with people. I'm like Olly Richards, I want to talk to people.

Right.

Um, you know, not, "Okay, I want to copy the entire Bible from Hebrew to English." No.

Right.

Or the Quran or, not the Quran, but the um, Torah from no, no, no, I I no, that's okay. Um,

Yeah.

Yeah. Do you have a plans of going back to Spanish and and sort of getting that last element or piece of the puzzle?

Right.

Uh, I, well, I thought about it. I mean, there's a lot of people that I've met recently where I've spoken them and they're like, your Spanish isn't that bad. It really isn't. You're not that bad. You know, I think I think what it is, you you had a lot of negativity thrown at you. And I mean, I I've I've talked to other people that feel the same way. They they they love the culture and the music and all that, but they're just not. And I guess because it was forced on me,

It's not the same.

Somewhat, it's it's not the same. It's not like, I love Russian, I love French. And because I took a world history course in Braille for a year, um, on and it was a distance learning course. Um, I fell in love with the um, Arabic culture. And and I was like, I this is fascinating to me, you know, what they had to go through and what everything and historically and what happened to them and and I said, I want my learning like Egyptian Arabic, you know, because I found Egypt and and that part of the world to be fascinating. Not to say I would visit anytime soon, it's too crazy over there right now. But, but I I just I've met people that are really nice, really welcoming. That's another thing I like about the language community. Yeah, you have your people who are, I want to learn 30 languages by the time I reach 60.

Really?

Good luck with that. You know. Okay, I just want to be able to communicate with people. And I feel that if I could learn something, even if it was to an A2 level, like Richardson could says all the time. If even if it was like to an A2 level in a certain language or B1 level, okay, fine. I mean, I'm not wanting to go up and give a speech on the history of Danish cuisine. I mean, I'm not that's not what I I'm doing it for. Plus, also to make new friends, because we live in a very global community, and I come from a very multi cultural family. So, me being African-American, I mean, I have some Native American in me and then it's the United Nations in my family. Like we have Puerto Rican and Chinese and Irish and German and yeah, it's ridiculous.

It's exciting.

So, yeah. So, um,

So you're doing it for the fun of it basically. Right. Whatever you feel like is interesting and exciting, that's what you do it. You don't do it because you want to tell people that you speak Russian or whatever language.

Right. Right. And I mean, I see that a lot. Like, to me, it's a turn off to hear people say, well, I speak 15 languages and and I want to learn another 25. Are you doing it because you enjoy it? Are you doing it because it's bragging rights?

Yeah.

Exactly. I I mean, after a while, it becomes a little bit annoying. And I'm like, okay.

Because the people, like, the people who speak that many languages, like, I mean, there I I I can only think of a few who speak, let's say, more than 20. They will never say a number. They will just say like a lot, or they will say I speak eight really well. And then they have like 22 double language. They will never say like, you would never hear Richard Simcott say I speak 30 languages. Um here, we just never say that. And and I think that that's the clue that if you genuinely speak a lot of languages, you're generally very modest about it. Like I I haven't seen people like show off and then actually have the skills to back it up also.

Oh, my God, yes. And and it's funny too because like I I have Richard and Anthony Metivier, Anthony Lauder, um, Olly Richards, and Moses McCormick, I love him to death.

Oh my God.

Um.

And you're close to them, aren't you? I mean, you you have you ever you ever talked about misting him or, you know, both Olly and?

Oh, you know, it's funny, it's funny because I was actually in Columbus last summer. And I said, hey, you want to meet up?

Oh my God.

I was in Columbus. But we never got a chance to do that.

Ah, that's a shame.

Um, but I have um, I have asked him questions when he's done his live feeds and stuff like that. Like when he was in Michigan with his friend. I would post something in Russian, because I he actually did a video a while back and he went to this Russian store in Columbus and was speaking Russian and I understood everything he said. And I understood everything the guy was saying too. So, he was I was like, well, that's not too bad, but this is what you might want to do to improve it. And and so like, I mean, and it wasn't that bad. I mean, I I I give this guy some props, though.

Oh, yeah.

Who the heck goes and starts speaking Hungarian, Polish, um, now he's on Armenian, I believe.

Well, he's like done 30 languages or something by now, so who knows what he's speaking this week.

Uh yeah, like it's amazing. Like he was doing Macedonian, he did Tagalog one week. It was crazy. I was like, my brain would probably be dead trying to

Yeah.

Yeah. I love that he just does it. I love that he just goes out there and just speaks to people because that's my biggest weakness is that I'm a little bit introverted, maybe a little bit more. So I find it very hard to just go out and speak to strangers in it. And yet alone in my own language, but what about foreign language, you know? That makes it even harder, so that's what I really admire.

Right. I will say I actually go out and do the same thing he does. I I I was in a cafe not too long ago. It was back in November or October. And this I was sitting up there and my grandmother was like, "Are you going to speak some Russian?" And then this lady was sitting with her friend. Come to find out she was a Russian teacher. Like she was American that taught Russian. And I just went blah blah blah blah blah. I was like, "Oh, S, uh, M, uh, M, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, 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um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, um, I, I have what we call a partial. So,

I'm just going to stop you right there. I have a condition called retinopathy of prematurity, which is an eye disease that I was born with because I was born three months premature and I was born in the sixth month of my mom's pregnancy. So it was like around the third trimester. I was born 1 pound 13 ounces. So, you know, they didn't know if I was going to live or die. My mother was 16 going on 17 when she gave birth to me. So she only had one kidney and I was lucky to be here. And so I actually was put in an incubator until I gained about 5 pounds. So I was really small. And it's funny cuz my mom, she always teases me. She's like, you know, your butt could fit in the palm of my hand. So, um, I don't I'm the oldest of five and they actually didn't realize that I was blind until one day I was crawling and I was looking at the corner of this table and I just kept crawling into it. And I have a dent until this day. And so my mother's like, oh, my God, you know, she she's blind. And so they took me to the eye doctor and they said, well, you know, she has some sight loss. So, she ended up registering me with the Cleveland Sight Center and then she eventually found a doctor in Philadelphia that was able to operate and save the sight in my left eye. And so, because it was so early, they kept patching up my eyes. They kept put I was born with cataracts. So they kept patching my eyes to make sure that they could develop properly. And unfortunately, because of being underweight and low oxygen, they did not develop properly.

It's minimizing your experience.

Right, exactly. So.

How do you, how do you manage then? I mean, with not being able to read? Like, are there any apps that you use or how do you, how do you handle your daily life in terms of reading?

I use a screen reader. I use Jaws. It's a talking software. And then I have something called ZoomText and Magic. So those are two magnifying software programs, which are like really old, but they came out in like the early 90s. And so it's a big screen magnifier. And it works with Jaws so that I can see certain things better. So that's how I read. And then I read Braille.

Yeah, cuz you don't you you don't strike me as a person who's like, oh, I can't do anything because I'm visually impaired. So yeah. I like that.

No, I can't. Yeah. No. I can't. And I'm like, I'm independent. I have my own guide dog. And then I have my own home. And I'm pretty much, you know, I do what everybody else does. So.

Yeah. That's, that's really inspiring. I mean, like I'm sure you meet a lot of people who are like, wow, you can do all these things.

Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. So.

Yeah. And speaking of languages, so you actually have quite a bit of experience. I mean, you've tried Spanish, you've learned Russian. Yeah. So what, what happened with Spanish? Was that not something you wanted to do? Because like you said, you're passionate about Russian now, but was Spanish not the same?

Well, it's funny because when I was in high school, I didn't take any languages. I didn't take any languages until I got to college. And when I went to college, I really wanted to take French or Russian. Because ever since I was 13, I wanted to learn either French or Russian. But when I went to community college, they were only offering Spanish. And I'm like, I don't want to take Spanish, you know. I mean, it's nothing against Spanish, but I didn't want to take Spanish. So they were only offering Spanish in the Eastern campus. And if you wanted to take French, you had to go downtown. If you wanted to take Russian, you had to go on the West side. And I'm like, I'm not traveling on the bus all the way over there, just for that, so.

Wow. So it left you so frustrated you just you just gave up essentially.

Right, exactly. So.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

But then I said, you know what? To hell with this. I'm going to pick up the language I want to. And that's when technology started to get better. So, I decided to do Russian.

Right. Right. And I understand. I mean, you know, if you're not passionate about something, it just it's so much harder to make progress. But if you have that passion, that drive then it's almost like you know, it just becomes easy to learn because you enjoy it.

Yeah. And I'm like, my goal is to be able to go to Russia and teach English to disabled Russians because they don't have the technology. They don't have the freedom that we have in this country. And they're kind of protected and sheltered. You know, unless you're in Petersburg or Moscow, you might have a little bit more freedom, you know. You can go to school, you can get a job. But I mean, I'm like, Putin has done more reforms to help the disabled a lot more. Actually, as of now, they have like electronic don't walk signs to indicate when you can cross the street. And I'm like, we have that here, but it's like in your main street crossings, it's not like your side streets. So.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

And I'm like, you know, my goal is to be able to go there, to be able to teach English, and to be able to help them because a lot of people like, you know, in this country, you know, you can do whatever you want. And you go to vocational rehabilitation services and they're like, oh, we need to get you gainful employment. Well, it's not about what the consumer wants. It's about what you need to fulfill a quota. You know, and it's sad because there's an 80% unemployment rate for the blind in this country. Why? Because they're not equipped to be able to compete with their sighted peers because they don't have access to a refreshable Braille display to hook up to their computer so they can read what's on the screen. Because a display costs $1,000 up to like $10,000. So.

Wow. Yeah, that's. That's pricey.

Yeah, that's pricey. So, because of that, you know, like I'm like, you know, if you're not able to afford it, you're not able to get it. And it's like, so I'm like, that's my goal because I love the language. I love the people. I love the food. I love the culture. I love the history. I love the politics. Everything about Russia. I'm a big history buff, actually.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You can actually see on her Facebook, like she's really passionate about Russia, the culture, the politics, everything, yeah.

Yeah. Yeah.

And what about Braille? Is that something that you learned early on, or was that also a choice that you made?

Well, it's funny because when you're in the education system here in America, they want you to use what you have. So if you have any sight whatsoever, you're going to be using it, regardless if you want to or not. So I didn't learn Braille until I was 8. And it's really easy to learn. So a lot of people they assume that it's a language. And I'm like, no, it's not a language. It's a reading and writing system. And so it's just dots and dashes. And I'm like, they even have Danish Braille. You know.

Wow. That's impressive.

So yeah. So I'm like, it's easy to learn. I mean, it's not like you're going to pick up a book and read it overnight type of thing. But I mean, it's like, you know, it's it's a system of reading and writing. But I actually had a lot of people in this in the Polyglots page, they're like, it's a language. I'm like, no, it's not a language. It's a system of reading and writing. So.

Yeah. They just want the badge to say that they speak more languages, you know.

Right, exactly. Exactly. I'm like, what are you doing? I'm like, no. And so I'm like, I actually learned how to read and write first in print before I learned Braille. So.

That makes sense.

And I actually did have something called, they just came out with something, because you know, every country that speaks English, they all have their own Braille codes. So like the UK, Australia, New Zealand, South Africa, Canada, the United States, and Nigeria, they all have their own Braille codes. So sometimes when you send somebody something in print and you want to translate it over into a Braille format, it's very difficult because of the punctuation and the symbols and everything. So they came out with something called Unified English Braille. And they adopted it on January 1st of last year. So it's a combination of Grade 2 and Grade 1 Braille. Grade 1 is the alphabet, Grade 2 is contracted. So it's like, you know, like when you're typing on your computer, you can do dot 5 H instead of typing out the word here. So it makes it a little bit easier for people, so that the seven countries of the world that speak English can have the same Braille code. So that was interesting.

That's, that's a good step forward. Yeah.

Right, exactly. So.

And you also volunteer now, right? So that's, that's where you're teaching English. What, what's that all about?

Well, I got certified to teach English as a foreign language. And so I'm actually looking for tutoring jobs, and I just wanted to get my foot in the door. So I started volunteering for a nonprofit organization called Project Learn in Cleveland. And they teach English to people for free. So you can get your GED, you can apply for your citizenship, and you can get help with writing resumes and stuff like that. And I've been volunteering since September. So I get to meet a lot of different people from the Middle East, from Africa, from Eastern Europe. And it's funny because I was telling my dad, I'm like, you know, I get to practice a little French, I get to practice a little Egyptian Arabic, the little I know. And I'm like, and it's free. So I'm like, it's a way for me to, you know, to talk to people because I'm like Olly Richards, I want to talk to people.

Yeah. Yeah. So you're putting yourself out there and talking to people on a daily basis just to make sure you keep your language skills sharp, you know, but you also teach them the language.

Right, exactly. Right, exactly. I'm like, yeah. Yeah, and I'm like, and it's free. So I'm like, it's a way to get my foot in the door because I love to teach. And I'm like, you know, my goal is to teach in Russia. So.

Yeah. Is there anything else that you want to add that you think is, is, you know, something that people should know about Braille, or, you know, disabilities in general, or, you know, anything you're passionate about.

Well, it's funny because Braille is very expensive. And so I'm like, a Braille book, one print page is about two Braille pages. So if you have a 350-page book, that's about 700 Braille pages. And that's about like four or five volumes. I mean, I actually read the Hobbit in Braille. And that was like 459 pages, but in print, it was only 272 pages. So it's expensive. And I'm like, so people can't get it. And I'm like, so people who say, "Oh, well, you know, you're not totally blind, so you can't learn Braille." I'm like, don't say that to me, because you don't know what it's like. So.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

But I'm like, you know, and it's like in Russia, they're like, they don't have any of the Braille stuff. So I'm like, it's hard to come by. And I'm like, you know, so I'm like, you know, just, you know, that's one thing. And then, you know, I love to travel. You know. I mean, I've traveled all over the country. I've been to Disneyland, I've been to Disney World. I've been as far as Toronto and as far as Oregon. And I'm like, it's funny because I want to backpack all over Europe. And that's another thing I want to do, because I want to see Denmark, I want to see Sweden, I want to see Germany and France. And I'm like, and that's another goal of mine because I'm a big history buff. So.

Yeah.

And I'm like, yeah. So I'm like, you know, don't let anybody make you feel like you can't do something. Like I'm going to be 40 years old this year. And I'm like, people say, "Oh, you're too old to learn a language." No, you're not. They're 80-year-olds learning Hungarian. You know. So I'm like, for real, I'm like, that's like a terrible way to think, you're too old to do this, you're too old to do that. And I'm like, why? Because society says so. I don't think so.

Because it's not about age. That's the funny thing. It's like people are, you know, 27, they're like, oh, I'm too old. I should have learned it when I was seven. I'm like, yeah, that might have been better, but the second best time is now, you know.

Right, exactly. Exactly. Cause if you don't do it now, you'll never do it. Like you'll still continue to procrastinate. And I'm I mean, trust me. I I said I I've been studying Russian since 2015. And it's one of those things where I can sit there right now, turn my TV off on mute, turn it to 3882, which is the Russian TV channel. And just sit I I'm serious. I will sit there and my my roommate will walk in. "Okay, so what's Putin talking about today?"

Yeah.

So I was like, well, pretty much the same thing. Well, not the same thing. I mean, they're they're they're talking about what's going on in Syria right now, but aside from that. I mean, and I'm actually starting to understand the news after, you know, doing the Memrise courses and and continue to listen and it I probably listen to the news more than I do listen to the radio.

Do you think that that's that's do you think that's like the osmosis effect, or do you think that because you're slowly improving your vocabulary as you go along, you actually start to hear the words in context more. Well, how do you how do you perceive that?

I started, I really do start to hear things. I I had that Eureka moment a couple times where I was listening, for example, to a YouTube video about this English guy that was married to this Russian woman and they were having this conversation about him speaking English, um Russian. And so he they kept asking him, like, what what what nationality was he? And he was like, "Oncle Shakin?" And then, "Da da da da da." And I'm like, and I mean like, I don't know what happened, but it was like the middle of the night and I just started it just clicked in my head. And I started listening and hearing their responses, the mother and the daughter. And I was just roaring because it was so funny with their response and I actually understood it. It wasn't like it was every other word, it was clear as day. And I probably had that happen three times so far. So I was like, "Oh, this is working."

Yeah.

So I mean, I'm I mean like literally I had to post that on Facebook. "I just understood this." You know. And I mean like I have um Luka Marello and um Alex Rawlings and them on on my Facebook. So um, I've um listening to him speak Russian, oh my God.

Holy crap. Yeah. Like, both of them, right? Both of them are geniuses at it.

I'm just like and he was like, I usually would spend two years at a time on one language. I was like, well, that makes sense. I mean, I love Benny Lewis. I, you know, I follow he was one of the first people. I actually read his audiobook. And um it was it was interesting. Um, I still I'll follow him on YouTube and everything and I stopped pictures of him and Lauren's wedding and it was beautiful. And I followed her language learning journey. I just didn't know she continued with the Russian or not. But she was pretty good after like six weeks.

Yeah. The Benny Lewis uh technique really worked, didn't it?

Yeah. And I actually wouldn't mind getting his um French hacking. But I do have to say, um, listening to stuff in smaller increments is a very good idea. Especially if it's 30 minutes at a time. Because anything aside from that, you're not going to remember it.

Right.

It's just going to go through one ear and out the other. And so, I mean, I've even when I give people advice or I'm tutoring them or, you know, on Facebook, I'll sit there and say, "Listen, just continue to listen and listen for 30 minutes." And then stop, because you're not going to remember what you just learned if you're trying to cram it all in in 5 hours. It's not going to happen like that.

Right.

And I and yes, it is true, the more languages you know, the easier it is to pick it up. But my thing is, okay, once again, if you want, what's the next language you're going to spend the next year or two wanting to learn? I mean, if you want to learn 10 languages in 10 years, that's great. But at what level?

Yeah, that'll be quite basic, I imagine.

Yeah. Do you want an A2 level? Do you just want conversation and all of them? Do you want a B1 level? Okay, well, guess what, you probably could get to a B1 level in a year.

Yeah, that's feasible.

But anybody like 90 days? Uh, I don't know. I I don't know how realistic that would really be. I mean, I could see in 90 days you can get to an A2 level.

Yeah, probably, with hard work and.

I can see I can see I can see that. Um, if you practice for an hour every day, five well, five days a week, you took the weekend off because you need to relax your brain. Um then you can do it. Yeah. But I I could not see someone wanting to get to a B1 level in 90 days. No. That is too intense. Like literally, you would have to have no life.

Yeah, but that's exactly what Benny does during his challenges, which is a little bit misleading, but, you know, when he does those three-month challenges, where he does get to a pretty high level, he would be working 8 hours a day, like a full-time job on the language from morning till evening. And that, you know, first of all, most people can't do that at all, but even if you could, then you can't do it anyway because it takes so much energy and motivation to actually work on the same language for 8 hours.